Justice Minister Adam Bodnar announced on Monday that he would present statistical information on operational surveillance and eavesdropping, including Pegasus, to the Sejm.
Bodnar was asked on TVN24 on Monday if he knew the list of all people under surveillance in the Pegasus system.
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What does the Minister of Justice know?
I know the scale
– the minister replied, adding that “it is significantly larger than what we know so far.”
My first step – I have a procedure under the Public Prosecution Act – is that, as Attorney General, I can present statistical information on operational control and wiretapping in Poland. And I will do it in the Sejm; I think this is a good place to say, on the one hand, what has happened in this context in recent years, but also to present what it looked like statistically with the use of this technology.
– said Bodnar.
The minister points out that this information may include information about the specific use of Pegasus.
It seems to me that the public has a right to know about this magnitude, it will be done openly
– added.
The second point is the question of what to do with the entire list (of those under supervision). These can be different situations; it may be that even if this Pegasus was used as part of operational control, it was used, for example, to identify espionage activities. Now we can’t really reveal it, even though we have decided – and I do too – that Pegasus is illegal
– Bodnar noticed.
The head of the Ministry of Justice added that in his opinion a “verification of the use of this operational technique” should be carried out.
If we see that it has been completely abused and used politically for some people, then I think each of these people needs to figure it out individually
– he pointed out.
For example: if we have an activist or journalist, he should receive a letter with the information: Dear Sir/Madam, such a technique was used at such and such a time, you can benefit from such and such measures, for example liability for damages from the Ministry of Finance, i.e. placement of the unit in the information centre. (…) Let such a person decide what to do with it
– Bodnar explained.
““A shockingly long list”
He added that the secret list of those under surveillance is currently at the disposal of the minister coordinating the special services: Tomasz Siemoniak. He said it was “shockingly long”.
The people I saw on this list – it’s hard for me to imagine the reasons why they would be subject to (control)
– said the minister.
Siemoniak was also asked about the list of people under Pegasus surveillance in the First Program of Polish Radio on Monday. When asked whether the list of names of people under surveillance would be made public, he replied that work is being done with Minister Bodnar on this issue, “how to bring these names to public awareness.”
Or better said, how to inform people who have been wrongly monitored illegally. This applies not only to software called Pegasus, but to all other similar situations. We must take into account legal issues here, because all these activities are related to specific investigations, judicial decisions and activities of the prosecutor’s office.
– added.
Last Monday, the first meeting of the Pegasus parliamentary investigative committee took place, which will investigate the legality, accuracy and targeting of the activities undertaken with this software, including: by the government, secret services and police from November 2015 to November 2023. The Commission must also determine who was responsible for the purchase of Pegasus and similar devices for the Polish authorities. The following people will appear as witnesses before the committee: former service heads Mariusz Kamiński and Maciej Wąsik, PiS president Jarosław Kaczyński and former head of the Ministry of Justice and Attorney General Zbigniew Ziobro.
Adam Bodnar’s statements clearly indicate that information about the Pegasus system will play a role similar to that of the investigative committees established by the December 13 Coalition. The question is to what extent this will serve to clarify the matter, and to what extent it will be an attempt to organize a media show where the outcome is predetermined.
gah/TVN24/PAP
Source: wPolityce