“New Skin and Biodegradable Phones”. Scientist talked about the future of plastic

— You create polymer composites based on promising thermoplastics for industrial applications. In what areas of modern industry can they be used?

— St. The materials we have developed together with the Institute of Macromolecular Compounds in St. Petersburg are composite materials based on modern polymers. They are used in fields with high added value such as the aviation industry and biomedicine. We are now moving on to more intensive use of our technologies – in the automotive industry, in packaging production.

It is clear that today it is impossible to live without plastic. Plastic is now used in everything, every day. Obviously, plastic also poses a problem because we need to find a way to remove it from the environment after its expiration date. But thanks to him, we began to live longer.

— Which qualities of new plastics are most in demand for the future?

– There are two points. The first is lightness. We can replace other, heavier materials with plastic. The lungs will obviously require less energy to move. Another point is multifunctionality: new electrical, electronic, magnetic and piezoelectric properties of plastics. We also work on computer technologies. Plastics can be very important in quantum computers, providing flexibility and allowing you to create new forms and possibilities.

— Could these new materials be used, for example, in the aerospace industry?

– We have a program for the development of thermal protection, which is also used in astronautics.

A flight to Mars would need protection from cosmic rays, and perhaps rubber materials could provide such protection.

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Italian scientist José Maria Kenny

POLYCOMP Lab, PolyCompLab

We also need lightweight materials that will be needed to carry objects in space. They are based on composites, mainly carbon fibers and polymer matrices.

— How long do you think it will take to create such materials for the aerospace industry? You mentioned flights to Mars, in how many years will we be ready for them?

– Our current calculations show that we probably need to build a three-metre-thick layer to provide protection for the duration of the flight to Mars. This is a very thick layer that cannot be moved. I now know that there are other solutions based on the use of magnetic or electromagnetic fields. Most likely, it will be a combination of materials and devices that protect against cosmic rays.

– And if we talk about construction, should we expect something new?

— Ten years ago I worked in a group where we developed what is called “flexible electronics.” Using polymers with electronic functionality, you can make, for example, flexible plastic TVs, plastic screens. Now Samsung has already developed such a bendable screen. Flexible electronics is an ambitious idea for the future. For example, it is possible to apply these technologies in photovoltaics using materials already made using nanotechnology. The problem is that the efficiency is still very low compared to silicon chemistry. Now we reach 4-4.5% maximum and silicon based photovoltaics have 20% efficiency. But

You can imagine what would happen if you made photovoltaic paint out of plastic and painted an entire building. You will get a large surface that will save energy for future consumption.

I think we will see such technologies in 15-20 years, it will become a commercial product.

– Is there an understanding of what it will look like, what ordinary people can see?

– You won’t see anything. It will be a building completely covered with such paint. It will look like it does now. The only thing is that in order for such a coating to continue to work, it must be preserved, washed. Presumably, the materials will be less resistant than they are now. But these will be large surfaces that generate energy.

Now we have such paints based on titanium dioxide, which have special properties, for example, the ability to self-clean. I’m sure we can find an application for the same system in photovoltaics.

— What are scientists doing to ensure that plastics and composite polymers still degrade?

— When we talk about bioplastics, we have to consider two aspects. The first is where to get the raw materials for plastic. Second, it is biodegradable. Optionally, the plastic obtained from bio-based materials will be degradable.

In Brazil, for example, polyethylene is now produced from ethanol from the sugar industry. In this case, there is no oily starting product, ethanol is obtained from sugar cane derivatives and polyethylene is produced from it. But the polyethylene itself is exactly the same as the one we use now and will remain in the environment for centuries until it is completely destroyed.

But for example, there are industrial processing products (eg food) that can be fermented. One such raw material source would be polylactic acid (PLA), which is currently the most widely used commercially. The origin of PLA has nothing to do with oil and it decomposes.

The curious thing is that PLA will only decompose when we place the material in the soil in a certain bacterial environment that can only attack PLA.

“Is something similar being done to produce the same perishable water bottles that flood the oceans?”

“We have a company in Italy that sells PLA bottled water, and they don’t deteriorate until you stop using them and put them in the soil with enough bacteria. And then the bottle decomposes – as a rule, 30-45 days. I believe this is a solution for the future.

And it’s not just PLA, there are also polyalkanoates, although very expensive, and there are other alternatives. PLAs are more interesting because they’re also used to create what we call cellular tissue engineering in biomedicine, scaffolds that allow us to solve problems in the body, or devices that need to be biodegraded within the body. We are already using this to produce new fabrics like leather. But I think there will be many opportunities for these bio-based biodegradable polymers, and they will come.

In this regard, the Japanese are probably the most advanced, I already know that they make PLA-based phones. You won’t be using the phone for more than 2-3 years, and then you can get rid of it without any issues by simply putting it in degradable conditions and it will disappear from the environment.

— How are new plastics used in medicine?

— Medicine, biomedicine is a big industry for us. We work in tissue engineering in only one part of this sector. The idea is to produce scaffolds, which we call structures (scaffolds) from which cells can multiply. We need some kind of foam, namely a porous structure, and polymers are great for that. It would be nice if the cells would then be able to proliferate and at some point the polymer would decompose leaving a new tissue, ie the polymers were a temporary structure.

Based on this, many groups of researchers are working on the creation of artificial leather.

– Are there other artificial organs created using this technology?

“An artificial kidney is already being produced using this technology. This was usually done in vitro, but now everything is ready to perform in vivo procedures. We will soon see many uses for artificial organs.

There is another technology that will help us – additive manufacturing. With this, we can directly reveal the forms we want to see in such structures (frameworks), then we add cells to them, the cells multiply, the polymer disappears and we get a new tissue ready to work in. body.

— Are your polymers used in drug delivery technologies?

– Yes. The ability to deliver drugs to where we need them is another possibility, very interesting, and here we need a polymer that will contain the drug and leave it in place. This will be used mainly in anticancer drugs and will make it possible to fully attack the tumor-affected areas.

Medicine is the main driver of the development of polymers.

– Mr. Kenny, you took part in the mega-grant program, the most important Russian program of international scientific cooperation. How did you make this decision? When did you first hear about mega grants?

— Ten years ago, we collaborated with Sergey Lyulin (then director of the Institute of Macromolecular Compounds of the Russian Academy of Sciences) on a Euro-Russian project. There was a very nice interaction on polymer composites. And Sergei and I at St. I remember how we had lunch in St. Petersburg, and then she told me about the opportunities mega-grants provide. He asked me if I wanted to participate in this program. I always say “yes” to international collaboration, there is a lot of international collaboration in my academic career and I was really comfortable working with Sergey on a previous project – so I said “yes”.

st. Petersburg, but I was a little skeptical about the real chance of winning. We discussed the matter, combined my competencies with those of the Institute and submitted an application. I was very surprised and happy when we won.

– Is your laboratory created within the scope of the project still working?

— Yes, it still works, my desk is there, and I hope to be in St. I can go to St. Petersburg.

— Are you currently collaborating with Russian scientists?

– St. Petersburg, I continue the dialogue with Sergey Lyulin, we are not officially cooperating at the moment, but we hope that in the future we can develop something. We did not win an application for a project last year. We will submit new applications when the opportunity arises.

— So, would you like to continue working with Russian scientists?

– Of course yes.

— What were your first feelings when they learned that you had been elected to the Russian Academy of Sciences?

“It’s a great honor for me, I didn’t expect it. I’m really happy. I believe there must be international cooperation. I don’t know why nobody has started something like Science Without Borders yet, because we scientists speak the same language, the language of science.

Recently, one of the universities of Rome stopped holding seminars on Dostoevsky. I don’t understand why everything is so confused. You can have whatever political belief you want, but you cannot go against culture, scientists, anything that is part of humanity.

To avoid talking about Dostoevsky is just as ridiculous and ridiculous as excluding Russian scientists from international dialogue.

And this is also one of the reasons why it is important to me that I am a foreign member of the Russian Academy of Sciences. If there is anything I can do to renew the dialogue with Russia, I will do it.