Thomas Bagger, the new ambassador of the Federal Republic of Germany to Poland, talks in an interview for Rzeczpospolita about relations with Poland, policy towards Russia and the near future of the European Union. He points out Germany’s mistakes in foreign policy and points out the causes.
In the case of the new German ambassador, the approval process by the Polish authorities was extremely short, unlike the previous one. The diplomat was asked whether this indicated a new opening in Polish-German relations.
Indeed, both the president and the government have shown flexibility regarding the deadline for submitting the credentials. My conversations with both Andrzej Duda and Sejm President Elżbieta Witek have been friendly and constructive. I hope this is a sign of a good cooperation
– He said.
I have come to represent Germany and I can say that from our point of view, relations with Poland have an absolutely special significance. As a partner in the Union, an ally in NATO, but above all as a neighbor with whom we want to maintain good relations. The Polish government must therefore decide whether to enter into such relations with us
– added.
A breakthrough in Germany’s foreign policy?
The ambassador argued that the invasion of Ukraine caused a deep shock in Germany and a change in foreign policy.
First, the invasion of Ukraine not only caused a deep shock in Germany, but also led to a breakthrough in our foreign policy. From Warsaw’s perspective, this change may seem slow, but it is very real and thus creates completely new opportunities for Polish-German cooperation
emphasized Bagger.
This is because eventually the German view of the world will increasingly resemble the Polish one
– added.
He also pointed out that in a just-published article, Chancellor Scholz made it clear that if we didn’t stop Putin now, our own security and prosperity would be at risk. He also referred to NATO’s new strategic concept, which does not exclude an attack on Alliance territory.
This may sound banal in Poland, but for the Germans it is a completely new approach, we have stopped telling ourselves fairy tales about the peaceful world of economic interdependence. There is potential for Polish-German cooperation, including in security and defense policy
The ambassador added.
The Ambassador’s Difficult Past?
Thomas Bagger was also asked about his political past as President Steinmeier’s chief adviser during the days of Germany’s increasing reliance on energy imports from Russia.
I was with Steinmeier in Moscow twice: first in 2014, when he led our diplomacy, then in 2017, when he already came in as president. And I can assure you that after the Russians took over Crimea, there were no more close, intimate relations between our countries. But of course, we relied too much on importing gas from Russia because we wanted to move too quickly from nuclear, coal to renewables, and gas had to be a transition fuel
– He said.
I don’t think it will burden me, I have also worked with Polish partners all these years, including on Russian issues, such as facilitating border traffic with Kaliningrad in 2010-2011. It is not that we have continued our policy towards Russia without taking Polish opinions and interests into account
– he added.
Myopia
In the context of German policy, the diplomat has pointed out mistakes in recent years.
It never occurred to us that Putin could destroy a business model that was so lucrative for him. President Steinmeier publicly dismissed this as a mistake. However, this was the policy of many successive German governments. And so were many European countries, including Poland, which still imports oil from Russia. Of course Poland was smarter and faster in diversifying energy sources, for Germany it will be more difficult and expensive to get rid of Russian gas, but it will happen
— he told the editor Bielecki.
When he analyzed whether the German political course allowed Putin to aggressively target Ukraine, he concluded that this was unnecessary speculation.
Putin has been radicalized in the past 22 years. Today, he is guided by imperial logic and wages a colonial war. Since he thinks in historical mythology, the costs are no longer included in his calculation. So I think regardless of economic considerations he would have decided to invade Ukraine
He pointed.
Mistakes and the future
Later in the interview, the ambassador answered whether only Germany should admit mistakes in foreign policy.
In Germany we have long been convinced that we are the most pro-European, progressive, even the best in the logic of the history of all Western countries. The deeper sense of humility we have experienced over the past six months. But it is also true that every country in the Union must free itself from the illusions that it has fallen victim to in these times
– He said.
If there is peace in Ukraine, will the former cooperation agreement between Germany and Russia not come back?
Won’t be back. Nord Stream 2 is not coming back. It will cost Germany dearly, we will face a difficult winter. The restoration of energy dependence on Russia will take longer for us than for Poland, because it was much deeper. But it will come. Scholz also very clearly supports the European ambitions of Ukraine and Moldova. He believes that these countries belong to the EU family, even though he thinks this process will take longer than Poland thinks. But this is also a natural disagreement, because Poland was much more directly affected by this war than Germany, it accepted more refugees
– he confirmed.
Poland-Brussels dispute
At the end of the interview, the ambassador was also asked about the rule of law and KPO funds.
I have no specific insight into the debates in Brussels. But I can say that the Union has been reduced to a community of states under the rule of law, the basis being rules that are binding on everyone. This is the basis of her success. And the Commission, as guardian of the treaties, must enforce this. Given the challenges the world is currently facing, it is in Germany’s interest to resolve this dispute as quickly as possible, but in a way that does not weaken the rule of law in the Union
– He said.
jm / Rzeczpospolita
Source: wPolityce